Store clerk hit with gun in robbery

A store clerk was pistol-whipped during a Thursday night robbery in George Town, Royal Cayman Islands Police said. 

Around 9.05pm Thursday, police said two masked men entered the DVD Store on Walkers Road. One of the men was armed with what appeared to be a handgun.

RCIPS officers said the suspects threatened a store staffer and demanded cash. The armed man struck the cashier with the gun before the suspects fled with a sum of cash, police said.

No shots were fired and the cashier who was struck did not require any medical attention.

Witnesses said the suspects were both about 5’5″ tall. They were wearing dark clothing and had their faces covered.

Anyone with information about the crime, or who saw the suspects before the incident or leaving the scene, is asked to call George Town police station on 949-4222 or the confidential Crime Stoppers number 800-8477 (TIPS).

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33 COMMENTS

  1. Thursday night robbery. Im sure thats not a surprise. But beware, its Fright Night in the Caymans tonight. Friday is a good day to stay off the streets and lock all your doors and windows because the freaks come out on Friday Night. Residents be on the lookout for the Stick Up Man, look out for your friends and family and if you see something suspicious do not ignore it, we all know they are out there looking for victims like wolves look for sheep and the RCIPS will be no help until after the fact so be prepared to protect yourself your family and property. After all its you that worked all week for your money not them.

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  2. Once again, the headlines are read by tourists, and once again CI gets hurt….
    One of the questions that I would love to have someone answer is; what has changed?..What is different..? Are there still undercover police?.. Are the courts handing down sentences that deter future crimes?..Are individuals being deported that commit crimes that are not citizens?.. Are they having town meetings with the heads of government and police in all areas, involving the citizens who live there so they have in-put and also feel protected, so they will come forth?….Again, I would love those questions answered…because if things keep happening the way they seem to be, you will see the tourism rate start to drop like a brick falling from the sky……………Please…If I could start some kind of awareness program involving the citizens of CI in each district, I would…please help before it is too late…….

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  3. I am sure the person that disagreed is one of the wolves or at least related to one. Probably a mom that says hes a good boy, he helps pay the bills while she knows that he doesnt have a job.

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  4. My wife and I lived on the island for 2 years. We loved everything about it, except the crime back then. We have had serious discussions on moving back and raising our family there and opening up our business. The last couple of months, all I read is Crime, Crime, Crime! We are now thinking about going to another island. In the states, the Caymans use to be a great destination for people on holidays, but now lots of travel agents have started deterring people from going there because of the crime. People know back in the states that the Royal Police dont carry guns, but the offenders do! I just hope something can be done really quick about this often occuring robbing and mugging! Cayman could be a great place like it once was.

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  5. My husband and I have spent 20 or more vacations in Grand Cayman and feel extreme fondness for both the island, our memories, and anticipated future excursions in Cayman. As of late, in an attempt to reconnect with the island, I have been listening to the Barefoot Man and reading the Compass news. The recurrent report of armed theft is so VERY disturbing. We have traveled to several Caribbean islands and one of the standout features of Cayman has always been the utter sense of security one feels regardless of where they go on the island, night or day. My heart is unsettled by the obvious change that is taking place. Part of Caymans pervasive beauty has always been the spirit and wisdom of its citizens. I distinctly remember being in awe at the way everyone rallied after Ivan and restored the island. I know these same characteristics will rally to face this current threat, and I send my deepest thoughts and prayers.

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  6. I say give the RCIPS the power to carry and use guns – if a person is found with a gun on the island that is not registered – then manditory 10 years in prison. If a persons is using the gun for robbery either shoot have the RCIPS shoot them dead or give them 20 years in prison. Enough already – go get a job or use that gun and shoot yourself to end your sorry life – good for nothing burdens to society.

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  7. @ HarsherPunishment – The arm the entire Police Service with guns, would mean to allow the people to arm themselves as well from officers. The right to bear arms has to be across the board! You cant have it like Lybia where you have armed police officers yet the people are unarmed and helpless.

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  8. Of course, the right to bear arms has worked wonders in eliminating crime in the USA! Texas is now the safest place to live in the world because everyone has a gun.

    Just for the record: Homicides per 100,000 of population:

    USA: 5.62 with 39% of households having weapons and all police armed
    UK: 2.60 with 4.7% of households having weapons with few police armed

    The Beachbum

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  9. USA: 5.62 with 39% of households having weapons and all police armed
    UK: 2.60 with 4.7% of households having weapons with few police armed

    Someone once said; there are lies, damned lies and statistics !

    Lets complete your statistical data with the most important statistic of all.

    US population, 300 million people, UK population, 62 million people.

    By your statistics per head of the population, the UKs rate of murders is worse than the USA with the rate being just slightly less than 50%, in a country just about the size of the state of Michigan or Oklahoma but with far, far more people than either of these two states.

    You also failed to mention that while only 4.7% of households have FIREARMS as weapons, your 2.6 murder rate for the UK is comprised of people who kill people by stabbbing, poisoning, bludgeoning and simply just beating and kicking them to death.

    No, you certainly dont need firearms to kill people in Britain; a good enough job is already being done here without them.

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  10. Funny how the lies, damned lies and statistics rubbish is trotted out when a person has no answer.

    The murder rates viz a viz USA and UK are per 100,000 head of population!

    But please dont ket the truth get in the way of a rant.

    The Beachbum

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  11. BB, you never fail to amuse me.

    Per 100,000 people you say?

    Now lets do the math, shall we? if country A of 64 million have 2.6 kills per 100,000 people

    and country B of 300 million have 5.62 per 100,000. Which country actually has the highest number of people killed per year.

    or lets make it easy for you. How many times does 64 go into 300? Then multiply the 2.6 (country As stat per 100k people) by that number you just got by dividing 64 into 300. That means, country A has 12 times the homicide rate of country B.

    Because unless both countries have the same population.
    You have to calculate the homicide rate this way, with thier stats.

    So, you are 12 times more likely to die in the UK by guns, than in the US.

    gee, and they say gun ownership is bad and doenst deter crime. You have proven than it does!

    thanks BB.

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  12. Big Berd…. you really should have stayed on beyond Grade School!

    In USA: you have a 16860 in 300,000,000 chance of being killed = 1 in 18
    In UK: you have a 1612 in 62,000,000 chance of being killed = 1 in 38

    Your chances of being the victim of homicide in the USA is more than twice that of the UK.

    The Beachbum

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  13. Big Berd

    You beat me to the punch !

    It seems like our good friend, the Beachbum needs a basic lesson in mathematics that any good primary school student would figure out in their sleep!

    I was going to do the basic percentages in my next post after Id read his response but youve already done that.

    Now look at the statistics that Caycompass have provided that states that since the year 2011 has begun, there has been a robbery or attempted robbery every 3 – 4 days in Cayman, most or all of these committed with perpretrators carrying and using FIREARMS.

    I am not an advocate of universal gun ownership in the Cayman Islands, as it is in the USA but anyone who thinks that this is an acceptable situation needs their heads examined.

    Its a feeble response from the Beachbum to be talking about rants when every single statment made by myself is supported by verifiable facts; the murder rate in Britain is a secret he does not want you to know because it reveals both Britain and the Cayman Islands as much unsafer countries than the USA.

    This is very much in part, due to the fact that the USA is a gun-bearing country but we will leave him to his fantasy world where he is much more comforable than facing the unpleasant truth.

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  14. Using the figures you are using.
    USA: 5.62 with 39% of households having weapons and all police armed (300 million people)
    UK: 2.60 with 4.7% of households having weapons with few police armed (64 million people)
    /per 100k people in each country.

    You cannot compare the two murder rates, unless both countries have the same population. And once equal this is how you do it.

    So. lets do that shall we?

    Simply divide 300 by 64, which is…4.6 times 64 goes into 300 million. (or in other words, the US has 4.6 times more people)
    So making the UK the same population as the US, we have 4.68 xs 2.6 (murder rate of the UK at 64 mil)
    which equals 12.16 if the UK was at 300 million.

    So if you want to compare 100k people in equal populations of 300 million. The UK would come out on top. At 3xs the rate of murder than the US.

    Its that simple.

    Or lets make the US as small as the UK. Lets play devils advocate here.

    And this is easier.

    All we do is take the 5.62 per 100k of 300 million people population of the US and divide the 5.62 by 4.6 (we are skipping out the 3rd and 4th decimal. Afer the decimal)

    which equals 1.22 per 100k murdered each year by guns in the US with the US population at UK population.

    And if you dont think that math is sound, Multiply 4.6 by 2.60, and you will get darn close to the 12.6 earlier. But we wont hit 12.6 because we are not calculating the 3rd and 4th numbers after the decimal.

    So…grade school?

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  15. Fiery,

    Do the maths…… twice as SAFE in UK than USA.

    I do agree that the use of firearms in Cayman is worrying and if you work on the premise that each of the 3/4 attempted robberies in Cayman is by someone different, then everyone in Cayman, will attempt an armed robbery every 100 years! Maybe the Premier should pass on his turn – someone might be able to recognise him!

    There is a problem with a small number of hoodlums who have access to a gun. There is no current evidence to show it is more widespread than a few hoodlums and maybe a handful of guns.

    But I do agree, the rate of robberies is a worrying trend but arm everyone and shoot everyone is hardly an answer.

    The Beachbum

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  16. We can break down these statistical facts in an even more simple way for our good friend…

    At 62 – 64 million people, the UKs population size is just about 1/5 of the population of the USA of 300 million with the murder rate of approximately 50% or 1/2 that of the USA.

    Rounding it off, 12 – 13 people are killed in the UK for every 1 person killed in the USA.

    Now tell me, which country has the higher murder rate ?

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  17. Try some new batteries in your calculator.

    In the UK there are 1,612 murders (2.6% per 100,000 population on a population of 62,000,000)
    In USA there are 16,860 murders (5.62% per 100,000 population on a population of 300,000,000)

    So to balance the populations, multiply the of homicides for the UK by a factor of 5 (3000,000,000 / 62,000,000) = 8,000 or HALF OF THAT OF THE USA

    So, it is TWICE AS SAFE IN THE UK

    Comprendez? If you require any further instruction in basic grade school maths, I charge………

    The Beachbum

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  18. Beach bum doenst understand or want to understand with MORE people, thier should be more crime. So you cannot use the UK as a stat, unless you make the UK comparable in population.

    And if he does admit that. The facts show, that even with 300 million people. There is actually less crime than the UK.

    Its like saying there are more red cars in the US than the UK so people must not like red cars in the UK.
    *rolls eyes.

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  19. So, USA has 5 times the population of the UK….. Yes?

    USA has TEN times the homicide rate of the UK ….Yes?

    So, the USA has twice as many homicides even with the populations balanced out.

    Mind you, probably most of them are through the sheer frustration as the lack of any basic numeracy skills. When did the USA school system abandon mathematics?

    I seem to remember I did maths when I graduated from High School in the USA in 1974

    The Beachbum

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  20. Beachbum…
    Is this how the police in the UK fudge the murder rate statistics ?

    By dividing the population into a statistical sample of 100,000 ?

    A skewered statistical sample will always give you skewered results; a population is counted by its total numbers when looking at trends such as murder rates.

    Remember, we are using your percentages here to apply to total population numbers, not police-doctored statistical samples.

    That sounds like McKeeva Bush standing up in an international forum and saying that the crime rate in Cayman is actually down !

    And of course, our good friend Commissioner Baines is who provided him with those statistics !

    You get my drift ?

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  21. Crime statistics are, internationally, calculated against a baseline – traditionally crimes per 100,000 of population. It is the same in the good old US of A. Same baseline, same statistical calculations. Without having a baseline you would not be able to compare across boundaries, say between states or countries.

    You could look at the US Census Bureau data to see how they use figures based on 100,000 of population.

    So, no fudge, just a simple way for simple minds (like one or two on here I could mention) to understand them.

    But, as I said earlier – why let the truth get in the way of a rant!

    The Beachbum

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  22. This whole string of comments doesnt really matter, we all know that people are getting killed all over the world. I think whats so surprising about the things happening in the Caymans is because its always be a place thats bragged about being Crime Free, but now youve lost that right. The escalating crime rate is shocking to everyone and will scare quite bit a people from the islands. You have to remember that Cayman is a very small place where people go to vacation and get away from home. In the US and UK being as big as they are there are actually quite a bit of Low Crime or Crime free places one can visit or live. There are a lot of people growing up in towns where a robbery or murder is unheard of other than on TV. So these folks will be scared to death of coming to Cayman where it will seem to be that Crime has engulfed the whole Country.

    One thing that surprises me is that MLAs can pull together all kinds of petitions and neighborhood meetings to fight against things like new Sea Port and Canals, When crime is the biggest threat to the Cayman Way of life, used to be you could sleep with the window open or walk do an quite beach at night or during the day for that matter, my how things have changed and I havent seen one of them try pulling the people together to help fight crime, Not even a neighborhood watch. All they do it point the blame at the other man and do nothing themselves, well thats just politics anyway so no surprise. Left hand blames right hand, right hand blames left hand while nothing gets done. This year everyone rallys against the UDP, next time around that same folks will rally against the PPM

    And all the talk of allowing people to arm themselves, people act like youre not allowed to own a gun in the Cayman. Any law abiding citizen that goes through the right channels and training can get a gun permit, there are currently nearly 900 people in Cayman that are licensed to own a gun so dont act like you cant. The guy that killed the intruder in his home did it with a licensed weapon, although I am sure there are plenty of people who will say he had no right and he should have let him take what he wanted and left.

    The bottom line here is that for the most part these thugs have everyones heart, the Police, the People, Business Owners and even the government are afraid to face up to this as a problem or even except the fact the Caymanians are involved. This is why in todays Cayman Society you have to lock your door, look over your shoulder stay in crowded areas and keep of the street at night.

    Because it is Excepted !!!!!!

    Just My Opinion..

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  23. NJ2Cay. I have to agree with a lot you have said and you can check my posting record and you will see that I have consistently warned Caymanians that the answer lies in their own gift.

    There are clear inequalities in the islands but these no way excuse crime and particularly violent crime and those who perpetrate these crimes must face the full force of law.

    The genie in the bottle is that these villains are more than likely to be Caymanian or those who are on the islands long term. People will know who they are, people will have their suspicions but until people are prepared to go against family people are NOT going to come forward.

    These are not issues immediately in the domain of the RCIPS but I would expect the MLAs together with other respected leaders of the community (Ministers?) to be urging people to come forward and rid these islands of the cancer that is slowly infecting it – slowly killing it.

    The future of Cayman is in the hands of Caymanians – for the sake of the futures of ALL your children, stand up and be counted.

    The Beachbum

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  24. Beachbum

    Another way to trick simple minds into accepting government/police doctored statistics that attempt to show that the situation is not as bad as the truth reveals…

    Fortunately, some of us are not so simple-minded or easily fooled.

    Your last post sounds suspiciously like opinions expressed by myself in a very recent post before we got into all this statistical debate.

    Are you completely sure they are your own, honest opinions ?

    Maybe, from your great wisdom and experience, you can suggest some workable solutions to this gun-crime problem in Grand Cayman, outside of arming the entire population ?

    Which, by the way, I dont agree with either.

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  25. Hows this for an idea ?

    Its time the people come together and devise a plan to put a stop to these crimes. Leave the investigating to the RCIPS.. Its the people who will have to bring these guys down. All it will take are a few decoys in the right place. With backup close by.

    Heres a few Examples that were used in the US. I will refrain from mentioning the outcome, just use your imagination.

    Newark NJ, June 2002, residents ina Newark NJ neigbourhood where there was a spree of Stolen Cars, equipped a vehicle with a remote shut down switch with also locked the doors. The vehicle was parked ina shaded area, when two thieves jimmy the lock and took off with the car which shutdown and looked them in 1 block away where residents were able to catch up with them.

    Brooklyn NY, Sept 1999, A String of muggings in a Brooklyn Park led residents to form a neighborhood watch which placed a female decoy in the park. When the mugger approached her they were met may the neighborhood watch strongmen.

    Winston Salem NC, March 2004, After being robbed 3 time at gunpoint a store owner mounted a 12 gauge shotgun under his counter rigged to fire by stepping down on a peddle under the counter.

    Jersey City NJ, June 2000, In an effort to curb the rash of tractor trailer breaking. Truck owners at a local rest stop spent the night in their trailers instead of the hotel. As a result 7 would be thieve were caught in the act by the truck driver.

    Needless to say these are bunch of guys who wont be robbing anyone else. Or at lease think twice before doing so. All of the crooks in these stories were sentenced to lengthy prison sentences in addition to the lessons they learned by being caught in the act.

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  26. Firery, these arent doctored statistics these are facts. The fact you cant recognise them for what they are – that the USA with loose / non existent gun controls is twice as dangerous as the UK which has much tighter controls -is really not my problem.

    I have been consistent with my postings on this forum, consistent in saying that the problem lies within Cayman and that it is within Caymans gift to deal with.

    But for Cayman to be given that responsibility comes the acknowledgement that Caymanians also have the right to decide their own future, to decide against a backdrop of what I see as a campaign by those who want to use the islands for their own means – using it as a simple tax break or as a place to get away from the horrendous problems of their own country that they have left behind.

    We can look at the countries where the current ex-pats come from to get an indication of their motivation: UK, Canada and USA – it is to use the financial freedoms of the Cayman Islands to get around tighter controls in their own countries. Remember there are things you can get away with in Cayman that you wont get away with in New York or London. They dont care about the long term future of the islands as long as they keep producing profits for their tawdry enterprises.

    Then there are the economic migrants, maybe from Jamaica, Philippines or Honduras who are escaping poverty in their own country to make money here. They dont care for the long term future of the islands either as long as they can make a few dollars along the way.

    There are clear inequalities in Cayman with young Caymanians being particularly hardest hit. I dont excuse the behaviour of these thugs or condone their actions but while there is inequalities these incidents are more likely. You see I dont believe in the right wing approach to crime that says that we all have a free choice whether we commit crime or not, I rather subscribe to the view that our environment has a large part to play.

    What I dont do is take the ex pat line that they are the ones who should drive what is provided in Cayman. You are but a visitor. You have a responsibility not to interfere in the country. Take what is provided and make no demands for change that is for your benefit only. If you dont like it, leave.

    So while I have tried to offer a consistent message others seem to jump on any bandwagon that rolls through town (usually being driven by a press that has precious little to talk about).

    The Beachbum

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  27. FACTS:

    Homicide rates tend to be related to firearm ownership levels. Everything else being equal, a reduction in the percentage of households owning firearms should occasion a drop in the homicide rate.

    Evidence to the Cullen Inquiry 1996: Thomas Gabor, Professor of Criminology – University of Ottawa

    The level of gun ownership world-wide is directly related to murder and suicide rates and specifically to the level of death by gunfire.

    International Correlation between gun ownership and rates of homicide and suicide. Professor Martin Killias, May 1993.

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  28. Beachbum

    I am very well aware of where your statistics come from and how they are compiled; they are meant to give a result that is weighted in favour of certain countries and against others and even some of the organizations that compile these statistics qualify them by making disclaimers that they are not entirely accurate or reliable.

    By this 100,000 sample population, a country like the Cayman Islands would show no murder rate at all because the population of the Cayman Islands does not exceed 55,000, at the most or would the statisticians use a pro rata method for populations below 100,000 ?

    My point all along has been that statistics can be compiled by a number of methods, of which weighted average is only one, to arrive at a pre-determined result and does not necessarily reveal FACTS.

    Leaving the statistical argument behind, you still have not answered my request for some workable suggestions to Caymans gun-crime problem.

    Obviously, you now live in Cayman while I now live in the UK so the problem of Caymans gun-crime is in your face, so to speak.

    I am not an advocate of universal firearms ownership for either Cayman or Britain as it is in the USA.

    I have lived in the USA and can easily reject any assertions or statistics you bring to prove that the USA is any less safe because of its firearms laws because of my personal experience of living there and travelling the entire country, not just one state.

    As a mtter of fact, the USA is the safest country I have ever lived in and that includes both the Cayman Islands and the United Kingdom.

    I try to offer some solutions to a problem and I will share mine with you.

    It is obvious that there is a deliberate policy in place in Cayman in not confronting these armed pobbers with armed police; if it were not so, special armed operations would be mounted on a 24-hour basis in certain areas by armed, undercover police and some of these robbers would be shot outright in the act.

    This would happen in the UK if any particular area the size of Grand Cayman were faced with an armed robbery attempt once every 3 – 4 days(Caycompass statistics) and that is a fact that you cannot truthfully deny.

    I have two suggestions to this problem; one Ive already stated, report arrested suspects names and post photos in media sources; this is done in the UK and if the suspect is cleared, that is also publicly reported and again, this is not something that you can truthfully deny.

    My second suggestion is to expand the firearms licencing process to legal citizens with no criminal records who can show just reason to own a firearm for their personal and professional safety and require certification of training from an approved firearms training provider.

    If the police will not confront these armed robbers, then certainly law-abiding citizens have a right to protect themselves by whatever necessary means that exist.

    The solutions that work for the USA will not work for Cayman and under current conditions the situation in the UK will not work for Cayman either, given the fact that by any statistical method you wish to use, Cayman has more illegal guns and gun crime than the UK per head of the population.

    My assertions are not made or supported from or by abstract statistics; they come from my own living experience in the 3 countries under discussion.

    These are my suggestions, what are yours ?

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  29. Oh Firery, you do amuse me so!

    The idea of statistics, in this case being weighted for or against certain countries is so laughable, I still have sore ribs. But hey, you dont understand so lets leave that there.

    As for your suggestions:

    Having the names and details of those arrested but not charged or proceeded against is simply opening up the game to vigilantes. Is that where you are, standing four square alongside the who cares if there is no evidence, well string them up just the same brigade?

    As for allowing anyone without a criminal conviction to have a gun – well, that means that lots of criminals will get guns – lots of people who dont have criminal records are simply criminals who have never been caught. And why would someone need a gun? Shooting rabbits or ducks? No, the only thing this would do is increase the gun pool and make matters worse.

    You want my suggestions, well, here goes:

    The problem has to be tackled holistically: You dont just deal with a symptom to cure the disease. First of all you understand why people commit crime. Of course there are a number of reasons. Pure greed may be one for acquisitive crimes while sudden anger might be one for violent crimes. If you accept that there are different motivations then you have to accept that there is no one size fits all answer to crime.

    In terms of gun crime, you first of all tighten up on gun ownership and possession. Unless you have a damned good reason for possessing a gun and you take all reasonable steps to ensure it is kept out of the hands of anyone else, you dont get one. As you are in the UK you might have heard of a man called Derrick Bird: He killed 12 people before turning the gun on himself. He lived in a terraced house and was a taxi driver – what was he doing with a shotgun and a rifle?

    You also impose significant penalties on all gun related crime. If possession of a gun (or any weapon designed to kill, injure or threaten) is part of ANY offence then the penalty should be doubled. No ifs, no buts. You had a weapon, you go down for twice what you would have got. If the offender is not Caymanian, then on the day of their release they are taken to the airport and put onto a plane to their homeland and they should never ever return.

    Finally, you enlist the support of everyone in the community to support these measures. If anyone knows of a family member who has an illegal weapon then they should be reporting this either directly or via an intermediary (Minister?). There should be no hiding place for people who commit these offences.

    Finally, I should point out that I believe in the rule of law. We cannot allow society to descend into lawlessness through vigilante acts. Once you are on that road it is a rocky one and it only leads to hell.

    BTW: I dont obviously live in Cayman! You have no idea where I live or what my background is so please dont assume you do.

    The Beachbum

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  30. Beachbum

    It is this mental sparring with such an elusive an evasive opponent such as yourself that amuses me so…

    You skillfully avoid key points in a debate that you do not wish to or have no answer for but I will give you that privilege, we all do it at times.

    Your mentioning Derek Bird shoots big holes (pardon my pun ha ha ha!), into your own argument regarding the UKs safety as opposed to the USAs safety, does it not ?

    You are the ex-police officer from the UK spouting statistics to support your position on UK guns laws so you should be able to tell me…

    How did Derek Bird have an arsenal of weapons with which he COMMITTTED 12 MURDERS IN THE UNITED KINGDOM ?

    How did Raul Moat have access to the shotgun WITH WHICH HE MURDERED ONE PERSON AND SERIOUSLY WOUNDED A POLICE OFFICER IN THE UNITED KINGDOM ?

    As Ive said before, statistics can be made to arrive at any desired result and prove absolutely nothing outside of the cold, hard, provable facts, which are…

    Guns are available and used to kill people in the UK in as almost a proportional rate as in the USA and your own stated case proves my point.

    On all other points, we agree, as Im sure that you have Caymans safety and well-being at heart as much as I do, regardless of where either of us live.

    Otherwise, we would not be having this debate any at all.

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  31. Lets leave the statistics aside for now. It is clear you cans seem to come to terms with them!

    Derrick Bird should not have had weapons. That case supports fully my assertion that gun control needs tightening. Had he not had access to weapons – had he not been given a firearms and shotgun certificate, I think 12 people would now be walking around that arent.

    As for Raoul Moat, he was barred from possessing a firearm therefore he had one illegally. The firearm will have been supplied by his criminal friends who get them, in the most part, from them being stolen from legal owners. Again, supports my case – the less guns in circulation the less likely someone will misuse one.

    The Derrick Bird incident of mass killing is, as you know, relatively unusual in the UK and I am sure you can name the other two key incidents in the past – Hungerford in 1987 and Dunblane in 1996. In the same 20 odd year period there have been many more mass killing incidents in the USA.

    I also like a damned good debate – what a pity the MLAs are not leading such a debate in the Cayman Islands

    The Beachbum

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